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Dr. Susanna Søberg: How to Use Cold & Heat Exposure to Improve Your Health | Huberman Lab Podcast

Andrew Huberman・140 minutes read

Dr. Susanna Soberg's research on deliberate cold and heat exposure explores the impact on metabolism, neurotransmitters, and hormones, emphasizing the importance of practical application and public education. Her work underscores the benefits of cold exposure for health, including increased brown fat activation, improved metabolism, and insulin sensitivity.

Insights

  • Deliberate cold and heat exposure can activate brown fat, improving metabolism and insulin sensitivity.
  • Exposure to cold water and sauna can trigger a Hermetic stress response, leading to various health benefits.
  • Winter swimmers exhibited increased insulin sensitivity and lower insulin production, indicating positive metabolic changes.
  • Brown fat activation can be achieved through various cold exposure methods, such as cold water immersion or sleeping in colder temperatures.
  • Short, frequent cold exposures are more effective for adaptation than longer durations, especially for individuals uncomfortable with cold.

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Recent questions

  • How does deliberate cold exposure impact metabolism?

    Deliberate cold exposure, as studied by Dr. Susanna Soberg, has a significant impact on metabolism. Exposure to cold temperatures, whether through cold showers, cold immersion up to the neck, or total body cold immersion, activates brown fat, a key tissue for regulating temperature and metabolism. This activation leads to increased thermogenesis, glucose uptake, and fat burning, ultimately improving overall metabolic function. Additionally, cold exposure triggers the release of neurotransmitters like dopamine, epinephrine, and norepinephrine, which play a role in mood and metabolism. Overall, deliberate cold exposure can enhance metabolism, making the body more efficient at generating heat and potentially aiding in weight management.

  • What are the benefits of cold exposure on insulin sensitivity?

    Cold exposure, particularly through activities like winter swimming or cold water immersion, has been shown to improve insulin sensitivity. Dr. Susanna Soberg's research found that winter swimmers exhibited lower insulin production and increased insulin sensitivity compared to a control group. This means that their bodies were able to clear glucose from the bloodstream more efficiently, leading to better blood sugar regulation. Lower insulin levels and faster glucose clearance can have positive effects on overall health, as excessive insulin and high blood glucose levels can be harmful. Therefore, incorporating deliberate cold exposure into a routine can be beneficial for improving insulin sensitivity and metabolic health.

  • How does cold exposure affect neurotransmitter production?

    Cold exposure has a direct impact on neurotransmitter production, particularly dopamine, epinephrine, and norepinephrine. These neurotransmitters play crucial roles in mood regulation and metabolism. When the body is exposed to cold temperatures, it triggers the release of these neurotransmitters, leading to increased alertness, improved mood, and enhanced metabolic function. Dopamine, known as the "feel-good" neurotransmitter, can contribute to a sense of well-being and motivation. Epinephrine and norepinephrine, also known as adrenaline and noradrenaline, respectively, are involved in the body's fight-or-flight response and can increase heart rate, blood flow, and energy expenditure. Overall, cold exposure can stimulate the production of these neurotransmitters, leading to various physiological and psychological benefits.

  • What are the key differences between cold showers and cold immersion?

    Cold showers and cold immersion are both forms of deliberate cold exposure, but they differ in terms of intensity and coverage. Cold showers involve exposing the body to cold water for a short duration, typically at the end of a regular shower. This form of cold exposure can activate brown fat and trigger the release of neurotransmitters, leading to potential metabolic and mood benefits. On the other hand, cold immersion entails submerging the body in cold water, either up to the neck or in total body immersion. Total body cold immersion provides more extensive coverage and a more intense cold stimulus compared to cold showers. This deeper exposure can lead to greater activation of brown fat and more pronounced physiological responses. Understanding these differences can help individuals choose the most suitable form of cold exposure based on their preferences and goals.

  • How can deliberate cold exposure improve overall health?

    Deliberate cold exposure, as explored in Dr. Susanna Soberg's research, offers a range of health benefits beyond just metabolic improvements. Exposure to cold temperatures can lead to lower blood pressure, heart rate, and improved insulin sensitivity. It activates brown fat, which plays a crucial role in regulating metabolism and temperature. Additionally, cold exposure triggers the release of neurotransmitters like dopamine, epinephrine, and norepinephrine, influencing mood and energy levels. By incorporating deliberate cold exposure into a routine, individuals can enhance their resilience, adaptability, and overall health. The stress of cold exposure, similar to exercise, can stimulate beneficial adaptations in the body, improving cellular function and reducing inflammation. Ultimately, regular cold exposure can contribute to better metabolic health, increased energy expenditure, and improved overall well-being.

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Summary

00:00

Enhancing Metabolism Through Cold and Heat

  • Dr. Susanna Soberg completed her doctoral thesis work at the University of Copenhagen, focusing on deliberate cold and heat exposure to enhance human metabolism.
  • She authored a seminal study establishing minimum thresholds for deliberate heat and cold exposure to increase Brown fat thermogenesis.
  • Her research, published in Cell Reports Metabolism in 2021, delves into the impact of deliberate cold and heat exposure on metabolism, neurotransmitters, and hormones.
  • Dr. Soberg addresses common questions on deliberate cold and heat exposure, including the differences between cold showers, cold immersion up to the neck, and total body cold immersion.
  • She discusses the effects of cold and heat on neurotransmitter production, particularly dopamine, epinephrine, and norepinephrine, which influence mood and metabolism.
  • Dr. Soberg's book, "Winter Swimming," breaks down deliberate cold and heat exposure protocols, covering cold acclimation, cold shock response, and the impact on human health.
  • Plunge offers an at-home self-cooling cold plunge for deliberate cold exposure, providing clean water for cold exposure benefits.
  • Maui Nui Venison offers nutrient-dense red meat products, including bone broth with high protein content, sourced sustainably from deer populations in Maui.
  • Thesis creates custom nootropics tailored to enhance focus, creativity, and mental clarity, designed to optimize brain and body function for specific tasks.
  • Dr. Huberman announces live events in September 2023 in Toronto and Chicago, titled "The Brain Body Contract," focusing on mental health, physical health, and performance tools and science.

14:20

Cold water exposure: resilience, adaptation, and metabolism.

  • Cold water exposure builds resilience and adaptation, initially challenging but essential for growth.
  • Deliberate cold exposure differs from discomfort in exercise as adjusting intensity is challenging.
  • Military Special Operations personnel showed varied responses to cold water exposure.
  • Individuals' responses to cold exposure vary based on adaptation and sensitivity to cold.
  • Cold immersion activates brown fat, a key tissue for temperature regulation and metabolism.
  • Cold showers activate brown fat and may impact metabolism and neurotransmitters.
  • Studies on cold showers are limited due to methodological challenges in controlling exposure.
  • Cold exposure triggers rapid neurotransmitter release and activates brown fat through multiple pathways.
  • Shivering in response to cold increases metabolism and should not be feared.
  • The "after drop" phenomenon explains core temperature decrease after leaving cold water, inducing shivering and activating brown fat for rewarming.

28:39

Cold Exposure Improves Health and Metabolism

  • Shivering increases insulin sensitivity and is a form of training for cells and the body.
  • Exposure to healthy stresses like exercise, cold, and heat improves cell activation and overall health.
  • Training in cold water and sauna is akin to a training center for the body, strengthening cells.
  • Exercise and deliberate cold exposure trigger adaptations that improve health and lower inflammation.
  • Long-term changes from deliberate cold exposure include increased catecholamines and improved metabolism.
  • Regular cold exposure enhances brown fat activation, making the body more efficient at generating heat.
  • Capillaries in the skin constrict better after cold exposure, preparing the body for future cold exposure.
  • Cold exposure leads to lower blood pressure, heart rate, and improved insulin sensitivity.
  • Brown fat can grow and decrease in response to adrenaline levels, affecting metabolism and weight.
  • Brown fat is insulin-sensitive and decreases with age, potentially contributing to obesity.

43:34

Cold Exposure Activates Brown Fat for Health

  • Individuals at the gym in their 70s and 80s are lean and have great posture from musculoskeletal work.
  • Many of these individuals grew up doing manual labor or were active throughout their lives.
  • The relationship between shiver and brown fat activation is discussed.
  • Cold exposure is a potent activator of brown fat, leading to increased metabolism and insulin sensitivity.
  • Exposure to cold temperatures, such as sleeping in a 19 degrees Celsius room, can activate brown fat.
  • Studies show that sleeping in colder temperatures increases insulin sensitivity and brown fat activation.
  • Brown fat activation can be achieved by exposing oneself to various temperatures, including cold water, wind, or cold showers.
  • Activating brown fat leads to increased thermogenesis, glucose uptake, and fat burning.
  • Anecdotes about cold adaptation and brown fat activation from personal experiences and studies are shared.
  • Scandinavian tradition of exposing babies to cold temperatures to build resilience and immunity is discussed.

58:03

"Copenhagen's Fit Lifestyle and Cold Exposure Study"

  • People in Copenhagen are notably fitter than in the United States, with many cycling and swimming in cold water regardless of age.
  • The speaker praises the Scandinavians for their active lifestyle and sun exposure habits.
  • Inside Tracker is a personalized nutrition platform analyzing blood and DNA data to aid in health goal achievement.
  • The speaker discusses a study on cold exposure, sauna use, and their effects on metabolism and brown fat activation.
  • The study aimed to understand brown fat activation through cold water exposure, particularly in winter swimmers.
  • The initial study was a proof of concept with a small participant group to assess brown fat activation.
  • The researcher, initially uncomfortable with cold exposure, gradually embraced it for health benefits.
  • Cold water exposure led to initial discomfort but post-activity, participants felt invigorated and energized.
  • Some winter swimmers stayed in cold water for extended periods, which the researcher found potentially harmful.
  • The study recruited winter swimmers adapted to cold exposure and matched them with a control group based on diet and BMI, noting gender differences in brown fat levels.

01:12:36

Gender Differences in Cold Tolerance and Comfort

  • Women are physically colder than men, with colder hands, ears, and feet due to men having larger hearts that pump out more blood peripherally.
  • Men are comfortable at 22 degrees Celsius, while women are comfortable at 24 degrees Celsius, leading to thermostat disagreements at home.
  • Women have more brown fat than men, prompting the study to focus on one gender to eliminate confounding factors.
  • Winter swimmers were recruited for the study, swimming for 2-3 seasons, with sessions lasting 1-2 minutes, 2-3 times per week.
  • Cold water immersion activates the rest and digest system, slowing down heart rate and oxygen consumption.
  • Diving response in cold water triggers activation of both sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous systems, promoting mental balance.
  • Winter swimmers alternated between cold water and sauna, with sauna temperatures at 80 degrees Celsius for 10-15 minutes.
  • Water temperatures ranged from 15 to 2 degrees Celsius, with participants doing the cold-sauna routine throughout the day.
  • Brown fat activity was measured through temperature outcomes and PET MRI scanning, assessing circadian rhythm and activation levels.
  • Participants rated their comfort levels on a scale during cold exposure and thermal comfort days, with muscle activity measured to track shivering adaptation.

01:27:51

"Winter Swimmers Benefit from Cold Exposure"

  • Winter swimmers showed increased insulin sensitivity and lower insulin production compared to a control group.
  • Insulin levels were measured during fasting and after consuming a glucose drink, revealing lower insulin release in winter swimmers.
  • Winter swimmers exhibited faster glucose clearance in the bloodstream, leading to lower levels after two hours.
  • Excessive insulin is harmful, and high blood glucose levels can be toxic to brain cells.
  • The optimal cold exposure for positive changes in health metrics is 11 minutes per week, divided into two to three sessions of one to two minutes each.
  • Sauna exposure of 10 to 15 minutes per session, totaling 57 minutes over two weeks, is beneficial for cardiovascular health.
  • The Hermetic stress response is triggered by short, potent stressors, emphasizing the importance of brief cold and heat exposures.
  • Psychological benefits, such as improved sleep quality and reduced social anxiety, were observed in winter swimmers.
  • Winter swimmers displayed comfort in cold temperatures and reduced fear of showing skin, potentially linked to their exposure to cold water.
  • Winter swimming clubs in Denmark have a tradition of swimming naked, with some clubs practicing this for hundreds of years.

01:43:24

Saunas and Cold Exposure for Health Benefits

  • In Denmark, saunas are a common practice, with some allowing co-ed use and others being gender-separated.
  • The choice of wearing a bathing suit or not in saunas does not affect the benefits of cold exposure or adaptation.
  • Winter swimming in Denmark is a tradition that promotes a sense of freedom and connection with nature.
  • Some newer clubs in Denmark require bathing suits due to privacy concerns and the prevalence of phones and cameras.
  • Russian Banyas, like Archimedes Banya in San Francisco and Spa 88 in New York, offer clothing-optional experiences.
  • These Banyas focus on health and wellness, with a tone of cleanliness and a co-ed environment.
  • A study participant lacked brown fat, leading to early shivering and difficulty regulating body temperature during cold exposure.
  • The participant's blood samples showed similarities to the control group, but he was considered an outlier and excluded from the analysis.
  • Deliberate cold exposure can lower inflammation in the body, potentially preventing lifestyle diseases and mental health issues.
  • Ending cold exposure sessions on cold can boost metabolism, activate brown fat, and improve muscle efficiency, leading to increased warmth and potential sleep benefits.

01:58:52

Benefits of Cold Exposure for Health

  • Deliberate cold exposure can increase brown fat stores, leading to thermogenesis and increased heat loss.
  • Cold exposure is best done in a fasted state, such as in the morning, to maximize benefits.
  • Cold exposure may help offset symptoms of diseases, like Raynaud's syndrome, by improving blood flow and vascular function.
  • Neoprene boots can help alleviate pain in the feet during cold exposure.
  • Keeping hands or feet out of the water during cold exposure is acceptable if pain is a barrier.
  • Submerging up to the neck in cold water decreases blood flow to the brain by 30-40%, potentially causing dizziness.
  • Dunking the head in cold water can increase heat loss rate by 36%, bringing one closer to hypothermia.
  • Wearing a beanie during cold exposure can prevent dizziness and increase warmth, aiding in longer exposure times.
  • Insulating the head in a sauna with a wool cap can help stay in the sauna longer by reducing the brain's heat signal.
  • Stimuli like light, temperature, food, and movement are foundational mechanisms for the body to adapt to, including responses to heat and cold exposure.

02:13:24

Cold Exposure Protocols for Smaller Bodies

  • Children are smaller than adults, so cold exposure protocols cannot be directly transferred to them.
  • A study compared heat loss in 12-year-old boys and adult men during cold exposure, finding that boys could defend core temperature like adults but had to use muscles faster.
  • A 16-year-old swimmer got hypothermic during a Pacific ocean swim without a wetsuit, showcasing the risk for smaller-bodied individuals.
  • Women may require less cold exposure time due to potentially being colder and having more brown fat, but protocols may vary.
  • Short, frequent cold exposures are more effective for adaptation than longer durations, especially for those uncomfortable with cold.
  • Varying water temperatures during cold exposure challenges cells and strengthens the body's response to changing temperatures.
  • Timing cold exposure based on circadian rhythms can optimize benefits, as the body temperature fluctuates throughout the day.
  • Changing water temperatures up and down, even within a range of 12-19 degrees Celsius, can activate brown fat and provide benefits.
  • Ongoing studies on deliberate cold exposure in both men and women are being conducted, with results pending analysis.
  • Dr. Susanna Soberg's research on deliberate cold and heat exposure highlights the importance of practical application and public education efforts.

02:28:24

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